PODCAST TRANSCRIPT | EPISODE 357: A LIFE POURED OUT
LIFE TO THE FULL w/ Nancy Campbell
EPISODE 357: A LIFE POURED OUT
I want you to meet another New Zealander today. More New Zealand accent! Sue Kuru was my neighbor when we lived in Palmerston North, New Zealand. It is my first time meeting Sue again after about 45 years!
Along with Val Stares who is now the director of Above Rubies in Australia, Sue was the first person to hear about the vision of Above Rubies. We share about the amazing things that were happening in those days as Above Rubies began, and in our church life.
Announcer: Welcome to the podcast, Life to The Full, with Nancy Campbell, founder and publisher of Above Rubies.
Nancy Campbell: Hello, ladies! Well, we’re continuing today to hear from some of my wonderful friends from New Zealand, back in the early days, when I started Above Rubies, and when we were raising our young children in New Zealand.
Last week you heard the wonderful testimony from Rebecca Southey. Now Rebecca and Sue, who I’ve got with me now, are sisters. Although Rebecca was adopted into their family, of course, they grew up as sisters, and are sisters today, so close together.
Today I have with me Sue Kuru. Sue is very special because Sue was my neighbor when we lived in New Zealand. Sue was part of everything that was happening. My weekly ladies’ Bible study when we all got together as mothers and all these children. Always more children than mothers! They were such wonderful times. She was part of our house group during the week, part of our church, and all that was happening.
Oh, mighty, mighty things were happening in those days. We thought it was normal, although we don’t actually see these things so much today. Every single Sunday, people would come to know the Lord and be baptized. The baptismal pool was always open, because every Sunday night, people were being baptized.
Ladies were coming to know the Lord at our ladies’ meetings which we were having all over the city. People were coming to know the Lord in our house groups which were all over the city. It was just the most amazing time.
And it was in the midst of this time that I got the vision for Above Rubies. It didn’t happen all out of nowhere. It actually happened through the vision of another woman. I do believe this that when you get a vision from God, it will always be ongoing, and it will branch off into greater visions.
What happened at that time was the inroads of feminism were beginning to infiltrate even our little country way down in the bottom of the world, New Zealand. These feminists were arranging a national conference and bringing the women of New Zealand together. It was under the normal women’s convention thing, but now it was being taken over by the feminists, and they were having seminars on abortion, and a female god, and all these different things that they were trying to bring in.
But there was a woman, a pastor’s wife, in Christchurch, Anne Morrow, who got the vision to put on a convention to eclipse this feminist one. God put this strongly on her heart, to have this convention, where we would have seminars on the biblical values for families. She asked me at that convention to speak on Motherhood. Well, this was the very first time I’d ever actually spoken about motherhood.
So, I prepared for that seminar and there were loads of other wonderful seminars. Anne said to me, “Nancy, get as many women as you can get.” I lived up in the North Island. She was down in the south. I ended up filling a Friendship plane, and just about filling a Boeing plane. You came too, Sue, didn’t you?
Sue: I did.
Nancy: Yes, we all went down to Christchurch, and we eclipsed that feminist convention!
Sue: We did.
Nancy: It was amazing!
Sue: Amazing.
Nancy: Oh, yes! And here we are talking. I haven’t even introduced you to them yet. This is Sue. Say “hi”!
Sue: Hi from New Zealand!
Nancy: Yes, and you're going to hear more from Sue in just a moment. Anyway, that wasn’t the end, because I came home from that convention and God put it upon my heart to start a magazine, something that would keep coming to the home, and keep coming to the mothers and the families to encourage them in their high calling. Yes, this convention was amazing but there needed to be something ongoing.
This burden was so strong upon me, the strongest burden I’ve ever had upon my life! In my whole life! And the amazing thing is, I can’t even imagine why God chose me, because I didn’t know what I was going to do or how I was going to do it.
But I had this vision, and the very first person, well, there were two people who first heard about it. Sue and my friend, Val. Sue was in the hospital with her little daughter, Hine. I went up to see her, and my friend Val also arrived to see her. What happened there, Sue?
Sue: Well, the exciting time we had there at the time.
Nancy: We were at the hospital, remember? I prayed for Hine, didn’t I?
Sue: We were at the hospital. Nancy brought some oil, and we wanted to anoint Hine and pray for her. We were on a mission for the healing of my daughter to be set free of this condition that she had. She was going in for a big operation and we were praying for that. We had big results. It was a miracle how it all happened. My daughter had three kidneys and was healed after the operation.
Nancy: Yes, praise the Lord. Well, anyway, it was there when we were visiting together. Then I said to Sue, and to Val, “Hey! I’ve got this vision from the Lord! We’re going to get out” (notice I said “we.” I didn’t say “I.”) I said, “We’re going to get out this magazine to the women of the nation to encourage them in their high calling of motherhood!”
Well, I remember Val looking at me with this blank stare. Interestingly, her name was Val Stares! I didn’t know that that very morning Val had said to the Lord, “If Nancy Campbell comes up with anymore of her great ideas, I’m not getting involved!” Well, she got involved. Val is still involved today, 47 plus years later since we started Above Rubies. She’s now the director of Above Rubies in Australia, carrying on. But that was the very beginning.
So, Sue, who is sitting here with me today, was, along with Val, the very first to hear the vision. Oh, it’s so wonderful having Sue here, and her sister Rebecca, and their dear friend Robyn. I’m going to do a podcast with Robyn too. Oh, it’s so great. We’ve been having wonderful times together.
Then, of course, we got involved. We began Above Rubies. I didn’t know what I was doing but I just forged ahead in faith. God began to lead me, and all those I involved, just as we went along. I remember saying to my husband, “I don’t know how we’re going to pay for this. I just have this vision.” He said, “Well, don’t come back on me. We’ve got enough bills, thank you!” I felt led to make it by donation.
I remember going to the Christian printers in our city. That was “Gospel Publishing House.” Yes, and I went to them, and I said, “I’ve got this vision to get out a magazine to the mothers of this nation. Will you print it?” Well, I told them, “I don’t really have any money up front. I’m going to make it by donation.” Well, I think usually they would laugh at you. But it must have been God because they didn’t laugh. They said, “We’ll print it.” I couldn’t believe it.
So, I plucked up much courage and printed only 1500 copies. Absolutely nothing to the thousands I print today. But I think that took the most faith because I didn’t know what was going to happen. So, the magazine was printed.
I was sharing at a ladies’ conference in Rotorua, New Zealand. I shared the magazine. I said “Take it wherever you go. Send it to friends. Send it to people. Put it in the waiting rooms of doctors and hospitals and dentists and everywhere you go.” The ladies left that conference, and they began to do it. I began to get letters from all over the nation, from the top to the bottom, saying, “Thank you for this magazine.” And they sent a donation. Wow! I went and paid the printers! It was miraculous.
Sue: It was.
Nancy: Yes, yes.
Sue: I’d like to mention that when Nancy got the vision, we were like an army. We were like a fort.
Nancy: Yes, you are right!
Sue: And all I could think about in this world is people, people. All we wanted was for people to hear about the goodness of God and we went straight into action. There was no worrying about whether we were going to get any help. We were a team, and it was about to bite forward. It was the vision of Above Rubies under the direction of the Holy Spirit and through Nancy.
We were never short of helpers. Everyone just wanted to get on board and help each other, and to see that this vision was brought forth. We learnt lots of things from this vision, being homemakers, mothering, cooking, giving, caring. And also having the fruits of the Spirit, which were love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. “Against such things there is no law.”
We were that army. Seeing that this was happening. We had a force with us and that was the Holy Spirit. We needed it to do this because we had the feminists doing their force, which is not of God. But ours was of God and we were moving. This was a beautiful vision that we could participate and help with.
Nancy: Oh, I know! It’s true, Sue. We were like an army together. We’re all together, because we were all in such unity back there. Another wonderful thing was that Gospel Publishing House so wanted to help us that they said we could come in after their workday closed when we were printing a new magazine. And we could collate the magazines, collage the pages together. Do you remember that? It wasn’t in the church. We just piled into Gospel Publishing House. We would be there until about midnight collating magazines!
Sue: It was so straight. It was going for the vision and seeing the vision for women of this nation at the time.
Nancy: I know. Here I was, a mother of all these little children. Serene was just a baby. But we were still all in the home. All of us mothers together were part of it. Everybody. In the evening, when a magazine was being printed, the men would come out too. We’d all be collating together. It was so exciting.
The second issue, I printed 5000. The third issue, 25,000. In three years, we were printing 100,000 copies for New Zealand. You couldn’t even go anywhere in the country without bumping into an Above Rubies magazine. I remember driving along the Desert Road. There was just a little restroom. I went in, and even there, there was an Above Rubies waiting! It was so amazing.
But yesterday, we were going through some of the old magazines that were first printed. I noticed that while we were in New Zealand (because we then moved on to Australia) that Sue, you actually were part of five of the Above Rubies magazines. It was so amazing. I’m just picking this one up now. This is # 5 way back in the ‘70’s, because we started in September 1977. This is a magazine from 1978. Here you are.
I did a panel with homemakers, speaking about being homemakers, and here’s your picture, right here. I’m asking here in this panel, “Sue, what does your husband, Jack feel about you being at home?” And you answer, here I’m reading it from the magazine: “My husband enjoys being a real man.”
Sue’s husband was Jack, and he was a married man, such a handsome guy. Such a lovely man. He passed away five years ago. That is such a loss to Sue. But here she says, “My husband is a real man. He loves to be the provider in our household. He definitely does not want me to work outside the home anymore. He likes to come home to a hot meal, and a happy atmosphere, and to a wife who is fresh and loving.” Wow! I love that!
Sue: It moved me.
Nancy: And that was the testimony of your home.
Sue: Doesn’t that make you feel particular, ladies?
Nancy: Oh, yes, yes. And Jack was a great provider, wasn’t he?
Sue: Right. Great provider.
Nancy: Oh goodness me. You’re telling me the legacy he has left your children! Whoo! And now they’re millionaires.
Sue: That’s right.
Nancy: God was good. He is faithful. You could have thought, “Help! I’d better go out and go to work.” But no, you just trusted your husband and he started off being a hard worker. But look how God blessed him and multiplied his vision of being the provider for the home! So incredible.
Then I asked you here, “OK, how do you manage financially, now that you're not working? Because you had been working before and God brought you home.” And you say, I wonder if you remember? “We manage well. I make sure that we have no more than two things on hire purchase at one time.” Well, in America, that’s on installment, or layaway,
“Best of all, I found that as I sought to do what God wants from me as a mother, that God has abundantly showered upon us provisions of food, clothing, and furniture. He’s a wonderful provider! For example, last Easter I was expecting visitors for the weekend. Sixteen people in the house! But as the weekend approached, I lay in bed, wondering how I would provide the food for them all. And then, the very next day, I received a check for $50.”
Well, how much would that be today? Goodness me, help! 45, 48 years ago. “Which I wasn’t even expecting. And extra food arrived from different people. Another time my husband was sick and off work. I’d invited a family for a meal. All I had in the house was meat and potatoes. I just committed it to the Lord, and that very afternoon, a friend arrived with a carton full of vegetables of every description.” And so it goes on, all these wonderful things that you wrote there.
That was, let me see, oh, the next one you wrote in was # 7. And that was in ’78, the next magazine. And you write your testimony here. “A SOFT ANSWER WORKS” And how in the beginning of your marriage, it was pretty hairy. But then Jack came to the Lord, you came back to the Lord, and things changed hands.
You talked there about, “Are you a nag-bag? I used to be. But now I love to encourage my husband, telling him his good points, and complimenting him. I love to give him soft answers. I have proved over and over again Proverbs 15:1: ‘A soft answer turns away wrath.’” And so on. That was a beautiful testimony.
And then, wow! Let’s see what number this is. This is # 12, and here we did another panel about hospitality. You’re talking in that one, too, all about hospitality. In fact, I remember, Sue, just right in the beginning, when you became the most hospitable woman you could ever find.
But I remember in the beginning, when I was speaking one day at our ladies’ group about hospitality. You came to me, and you said, “Nancy, I so want to ask people, but we’re just on our budget. I don’t know how we could get extra to feed extra.” I said to you, “Sue, just go ahead in faith, and ask a family that is on your heart, and see what God will do.” So, you went ahead in faith and did it. And then . . .
Sue: Knock, knock at the door. A box of groceries that added to the meat and potatoes. I found out it was from a family that had five children, and they didn’t have a lot of money. I’m just saying it was the Lord at the time. He knew exactly what I needed.
Nancy: Yes! And then, from then on, goodness me, you never stopped! You haven’t stopped having people in your home to this day!
Sue: Not to this day, Nancy. I’m going to be 74.
Nancy: Yes, that is so amazing. Oh, yes, and then, let’s see, what’s here? No. 13. This time, it’s actually a beautiful feature page. It’s a picture of your beautiful little boy, Arana. Oh, such a handsome little boy! I wish I could show you this picture. We had a poem with this picture. It was written by Beryl Person. She was another one of the lovely ladies in our fellowship. She wrote this poem. Oh, wow. I should read it out.
My Influence
By my bickering and arguing,
By my loud voice and impatience,
By my condemning and disapproving voice,
I can so hurt this small child of mine.
I can make him want to run and hide.
I can make him afraid and scared of the world.
I can make him into such a nervous child—
One who stammers and stutters,
One who feels insecure and very unsure,
One who feels so unloved.
BUT
by my patience and my love,
By my kindness and my care,
By encouragement each day,
I can make him a very different child—
One who is unafraid.
One who will face the world with confidence
and self-assurance.
One who will love others as himself is being loved.
Who then would dare to stand and say,
“A mother’s role is nothing?”
If you and I can mold a child,
And so affect his future,
Then the role we have
Is the greatest role God can give.
Amen! And then you were in number 17! Here we did another panel. This panel is called “Let’s Encourage One Another.” Do you remember that back then? That was just our lifestyle.
Sue: It was our lifestyle. And it was known in our street. We were known as the “Bible study they had that the talk that went on.” It was incredible. We got ladies into the Bible study. We had ladies give their hearts to the Lord and copied all what we were doing, all the mothering parts of being a mother, and all the hospitality things, and all the cooking, and all the healthy cooking that we were doing as well.
Nancy: Yes, yes! Let me see if I can pick out some of the little things you say in this panel. Of course, there were others in the panel too. This is Sue.
“A wonderful way that I’ve found to encourage people is by posting them a lovely card, with a personal message of encouragement or appreciation. I’ve had so much joy in blessing widows, single mothers, and mothers at home. Every time I do this, it’s always the perfect timing.
“It’s a good idea to have a pile of cards handy for when the Lord lays someone on your heart. I search for hours in bookshops for appropriate cards. One time my next-door neighbor, who knew we were Christians, asked me to pray for a friend of hers who was very ill. For three consecutive days, which was always while I was hanging out the washing, the clothes on the line, the Lord impressed me to send her a card. I shared with her that although I did not know her, I was praying for her. I told her that Jesus loved her and wanted to be her Friend. I told her how she could find Jesus as her Savior. This lady was so blessed by receiving this from me that she found out where I lived and came to thank me. The following day she died. How glad I was that I obeyed the prompting of the Lord.”
Sue: I remember now.
Nancy: And then, I actually share a little testimony in that panel. And it was about your mother! Your mother Maureen Green. And Sue’s mother was a widow. She lived with you, Sue, for how many years?
Sue: Ten years.
Nancy: Ten years. Such a wonderful, godly woman. Anyway, I shared this wonderful testimony. One of the ladies in our fellowship, and in our ladies’ Bible study . . . It was Maureen’s birthday, Sue’s mother’s birthday. She wanted to do something lovely for her, so she went to the shop, and said, “Lord, show me what I should buy for her.”
And the Lord directed her to a beautiful little vase, and it was just a vase that would only hold one flower. It was so pretty and beautiful. She took it to your mom. Oh, your mom was so blessed that she would think of her and buy her this beautiful gift.
But God wasn’t finished yet. There was another lady in the fellowship, and she also had Maureen on her heart. She said, “Lord, I want to give her something for her birthday. What should I do?” She thought she’d give her some flowers. So, she goes to the florist shop and looks at all these beautiful bunches of flowers. “Oh,” she said, “I’d just love to get them. They’re so beautiful!”
And yet she didn’t feel right. She kept walking around, and she found this one flower. It may have been an orchid. I’m not sure. But it was one flower on its own. She knew that’s what she had to buy! “Lord, why am I only buying one flower?” But she obeyed the prompting of the Lord.
A little while later, after Maureen had received this vase, this other lady arrived to bless her on her birthday with the one flower to go in the vase that would only take one flower. Just such a little thing, but both of these ladies were prompted by the Spirit of the Lord. This is the glorious ministry of encouraging one another. It’s supernatural. When we listen to the Lord, His heart, He wants us to encourage. Wow! Miracles take place, don’t they? Oh, yes.
That’s just a little glimpse, ladies, of the early days of Above Rubies, where Sue lived next door to me, and her oldest daughter Rochelle was Pearl’s best friend. Pearl can’t wait to come tomorrow night to Shabbat so she can hear all about Rochelle, and what’s happening, and catch up with her. And then Serene was friends with Hine. They were such wonderful days. What do you want to say, Sue?
Sue: What do I want to say? All those years, and all your years, as women, all the saints that have gone before you are to make you who you are now in this day and age. All that we experienced, all the education that we had over the years with being with people, because life without people . . . When we’re with people, this is how we learn. It’s like an education with us. We learn things that can help us walk in the direction of what we’re meant to be doing and how we choose things. This has been my walk and my life with how to walk with the Lord. That’s always been connected to natural type spiritual people. That’s what Above Rubies is all about as we’ve just heard.
Nancy: I think, Sue, after we left New Zealand, and that was, I was working it out, 43 years since we left New Zealand. So, we are meeting together. This is the first time in 43 years!
Sue: It is.
Nancy: It’s so amazing! But when we left, your life continued. Your life has been one of just pouring out to people. You adopted this little boy. Maybe you could tell us about him.
And then you went on to foster very needy people and you're still fostering one today, at 74 years of age. Our time is getting to an end, but tell us about your adopted boy, and then maybe tell us about the one you are looking after now, even though you've had so many in between.
Sue: My adopted boy. That’s lovely, Nancy. He comes from a background of gang members.
Nancy: That’s quite a big thing amongst the Maori people.
Sue: It is. I was a nurse at Te Awamutu Hospital. One of the social workers came and said, “We’ve got this baby here. He’s been here for three months. Sue, what are we going to do with him?”
I said, “Well, I’ll just take him home as an emergency. But the emergency grew, because I was a woman who loved children, and loved family. I love seeing people go forward in their lives. So, I spoke with all the children. We all sat round the table. I said, “Are we going to have this baby come into our lives?” They said, “Yes.”
Then it came to . . . there was a gap over the love and attention that this baby was given. Then there was a time when we had to make a decision for the mother to come and stay with us. I was there to put all into this mother, all the things that we had learned through Above Rubies. The mother flourished but still wanted to move on about five hours from us to a place called Auckland. I was to give the baby back.
I gave Matthew back, and it wasn’t too long after when I got a phone call from a social worker saying, “There’s been a baby screaming for one week.” We’ve been to see him. Do you agree to take him?” The baby was Matthew. He hadn’t eaten any food for a week. The mother had taken off and just left him there. They said, “We will fly you to Auckland to pick this baby up.” So, I did that.
When I saw him, he had a dark face. He left my care with a large suitcase of beautiful things, clothes, and diapers. When I picked him up from the airport, he had a paper bag with one diaper in it. It looked like he didn’t know. He just looked terrible. When I got him on the plane, the Lord said to me, “Start singing to him, Sue, like you used to.” I started singing to him in his ear in the plane and I saw this darkness just leave him to life.
He came back into our lives, and then we all had to have another family meeting/get-together to make a decision. Did we want to keep this child and adopt him? We made sure that the children knew that he was going to be equal to all the other children. He is going to be treated no differently. He’s going to be loved like you children are. That’s what we did.
And later on in life, the years have gone. We had a beautiful life with Matthew just like we did with all our children. Then he got into the drug scene, which is very, very sad. We never knew that. And alcohol. That changed his life for a number of years. We’ve always loved him. We always will love him and fight for what he is.
But he’s homeless at the moment, which is hard for a grieving mother who would like him to be set free of that. We love him, and we pray for him. He’s 36 now. When he sees me, he says, “You’re right, Mom? Are y ou alright without Dad?” because my husband’s passed away. He’s with the Lord. Matthew said, “I love you heaps, Mom,” but he still wants to stay in this state. What I’m saying is, I always look at the end result of his life, and I believe by prayer for him, and loving him through it, he will be the Lord’s.
Nancy: Yes. And then, you know, we could be here all day, just hearing the stories of these very needy people that you have continued to foster throughout the years. Just tell us about the one you have now.
Sue: The one I have now? She is cognitively five. She is named Crystal.
Nancy: But she’s about 22.
Sue: She’s 22 years of age, but she’s got the brain of a five-year-old. I’ve had her since she was three, and she’s now 22. She loves the Lord. I’ve had the privilege of leading five children to the Lord, and she’s one of them. She loves going to Sunday school and looking after all the babies.
I’ve had a ministry of leading five children that I’ve had, from very severe autism to physical scoliosis. All these other conditions, heart disease, and four of them have passed onto the Lord during the years that I’ve had them. What a blessing it is to be able to be involved with that!
Nancy: Yes. And you embrace these people that no one else has even been willing to take.
Sue: That’s true.
Nancy: Thank you, Sue. Well, just continue in your beautiful life, just pouring out, not only to your family, but to everyone you come into contact with. Even now, you still have meetings in your home, don’t you?
Sue: Oh, I do. Prayer meetings for Israel, Prayer meetings for the pastors, and worship and praise in the house. I’m helping a woman. I’m going to be getting some tips from Nancy. It’s a shift, 43 years later. I’ll get the feeding from her before I leave. All I can say to you ladies is:
“People, people, people. Love, love, love. Hospitality, hospitality, hospitality.”
Nancy: Amen. Thank you, Sue. It’s been the greatest joy to be with you again.
“Lord, we thank You so much for the way you lead each one of our lives. And Lord God, we pray today for every precious mother and wife listening. And I pray, Lord, that many of them have got wonderful friends around them. Many of them haven’t. And I pray that You will help them to find kindred spirits, Lord God.
“I think back to our days when we were in New Zealand, and Sue was part of so many other mothers. We all learned our mothering together. We shared our joys. We shared our challenges. That was what kept us, well really, always in joy, because we had one another. There’s something powerful about having one another. And I pray that You will help mothers, Lord, who feel isolated, that You will bring to them kindred spirits. Help them to find the right fellowship to be part of. In the Name of Jesus, Amen.”
Blessings from Nancy Campbell
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Transcribed by Darlene Norris
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DON’T FORGET TO TELL OTHERS ABOUT THIS PODCAST, “LIFE TO THE FULL” WITH NANCY CAMPBELL.” DON’T KEEP THE BLESSINGS TO YOURSELF. IT IS ENCOURAGEMENT FOR ALL WIVES AND MOTHERS.